› Around the corner, and for people who don't know this, every time there's a new ANC president, it seems that the ANC president who's president of the state resigns, steps down, or leaves. If he makes it to that point where there is a successor, where somebody can fulfill his seat, will this impeachment even be a question of importance? Will it even matter? Because then he won't be president. And then he would have delayed the process so long. And particularly, and I think this is the most important thing, which is why impeachments are so core, what people don't appreciate.
› About impeachments is that impeachments remove you of all your presidential benefits. Unlike a vote of no confidence, which simply dissolves the government, it means that you essentially lose your status, you lose your security, you lose all the benefits that have been ascribed to you as the president. So the risks are major in this sense that if he loses and if he gets impeached, he no longer holds his power. So I believe wholeheartedly that if you are of the Cyril camp, delay until.
› Forever. Delay until you're no longer in office. But if you're a South African, there's definitely a concern, there's definitely a need for urgency. And hopefully the courts get it right this time. I mean, there are a few things that you touch on, though, which were very evident in the argumentation that was being made in court today. I mean, we heard senior counsel for the opposition party saying that part of Ramaphosa's strategy is to apply a Stalingrad tactic: delay, delay, delay, and delay again. But also arguing that the constitutional