SAfm, Tuesday afternoon

But then yesterday disputed quite a bit of the contents contained therein. And this morning, a heated exchange unfolded between Commissioner Sandile Kumalo and Wusmuzi Katmatlala's attorney, advocate Anlin Vandenhefer, over whether consultations with Commission investigator Bongani Dlamini were conducted off the record. Now, Kumalo questioned advocate Vandenhefer's claim, citing a draft affidavit that emerged from the consultation.

Consultations asking whether the discussions could truly have been off the record. The Commission chairperson, Muisi Elimatlanga, had to come in to resolve the matter. You say, as being suggested, that you are not telling the truth, it goes both ways in the sense that that equally means that Miss Silo is also not telling the truth. Can I just finish?

Yeah, and by making that point, I'm not necessarily saying it is Ms. Silo who's telling the truth and that you are not, and vice versa. I'm also not saying you are telling the truth and she is not. But I'm just saying when you emphasize the fact that it's being said that you are not being truthful, I'm saying that's equally true of Ms. Silo. But she's not addressed the meetings that we had on the 24th and the 25th. That's why I'm saying.

It doesn't seem to me as though she's disputing that we had these discussions where the people were present. What she's disputing is the origins of the consultations that were had. And there you are correct, and Mr Louise correct. I act on instructions and that's why I approached them and said this is my instructions. If you are intending to pursue this, my instructions is that there will be affidavits to post to and then we can place it before the Commission.

And the Commission can then decide if it was an off-the-record or an on-the-record discussion. And as a result of that, I was then told that it was, there's an agreement, they had a meeting between themselves. Who's present? I don't know. But they're not pursuing the point anymore because they agreed the discussion was off the record. And that happened on, I think, it was Wednesday, the 26th, if I'm not mistaken. And the reason why I remember it so well is that.

There was a tiff between me and Miss Hussel. We had an issue. Do you understand? I recall almost verbatim what happened on the Tuesday when I arrived. That she was angry with me, and I turned out to be angry with her because of what I said. Because when I approached her, I said, I'm doing this because I'm duty bound and ethically bound to first approach you. I'm not going to make a story of it at the Commission. I'm telling you this now. Can we sort it out off the list?

Court before we make a hoo-ha about it at the Commission. And that's what led to the discussion and then them coming back and saying to us, and that is my issue. If it's disputed that they came back to me on that Wednesday and to say to me that there was in fact an agreement to that, there's many of us that will go under oath and confirm that. I have no reason to come and say to the Commission, this is what.