702, Wednesday afternoon

Companies and individuals found guilty of wrongdoing, which I'm sure you must agree is rife in municipalities everywhere. Is that because you haven't successfully managed to do that in the municipalities where you are? No, it's because we are not running municipalities. We are in collision in some municipalities and we're running departments. But we don't have a single municipality that we are running completely.

On our own, because we have not yet won outright majority in that municipality. But what we are saying: should we win outright majority? That is exactly what we are going to do. Because corruption cannot be shielded. People must take accountability. There must be consequence management. We can't keep on complaining about Umpile doing wrong things and we still continue awarding the same tendency to the same person who has been found in the wrong. But I must ask you: if you were able to achieve all these other things which you list.

While being in coalitions, why have you not managed to blacklist anyone and contribute to that process? But I'm saying in the departments that we run, there hasn't been any company that has done wrong things that needs to be blacklisted. So our scope is very small, Joan. So maybe if we expand our scope, we take the entire municipality. I mean, look at Tshwane for an example. We've got only two departments. We've got only two MMCs out of the ten MMCs.

MMC of health, LMC of waste. You go to JOREC, only two again: health and safety. So, in the departments that they are running, there hasn't been that case of us going to an extent of even blacklisting. But we say. You're extraordinarily lucky, wouldn't you say? I mean, given the extent to which there have been companies that deserve blacklisting, it's a great fortune that the EFF has never encountered a company like that.